Attack of the Shoes

I’d like to clarify and an expand on a few points about the shoe throwing incident because I’m clearly in the minority here in my opinion that throwing shoes at the president is wrong.

I don’t think I need to repeat my record of vigorously opposing President Bush and his administration. Suffice it to say, there’s no doubt that President Bush deserves a stinking pile of comeuppance hurled at his inappropriately smirking face. But not in the form of actual projectiles.

Yes, he’s a very, very awful man and he’s done a wide array of very, very awful and unforgivable things that will require decades to undo. I’m just not so sure how awesome it is to embrace the fallacy that violence deserves more violence and, as some have argued, vengeance — no matter how bizarre the retaliatory act might be (quoting Austin Powers: “Who throws a shoe?! I mean, really.”).

If this makes me look weak or apologetic towards President Bush, I don’t know what to tell you other than: this has little if anything to do with George W. Bush as a man or as a leader. My opinion on this thing has everything to do with defining how I feel about 1) violent retaliation, and 2) my respect for the office of the presidency.

To that point, it’s easy (and somewhat hipster-ish) to cynically reject and condemn the presidency and to categorically label it as a corrupt and guilty office based upon some of the jagoffs who have served in that role. That’s not to say we shouldn’t loudly oppose the president’s policies and actions when deserved, but personally I’ve always tried to grapple onto a basic respect the office — both as a form of patriotism and as a template for how the office should ideally be occupied, thereby holding the occupier accountable to a higher standard of conduct.

And this incident, regardless of the man at the podium, was a physical attack on the president — and that offends me, both as someone who seeks non-violent ideas and solutions, but also as an American. That said, applaud all you want for the shoe-tosser. Maybe it’s cathartic. I don’t know. I just can’t join you on this one.

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  • JG

    agree 100%

  • http://unrelatedcontent.com Travis Disaster

    I just can’t see how a person as educated as yourself can still see the Presidency as a mystical title. Maybe I’m just a DFH Hipster Socialist, but I feel that no man is above any other. Created equal, and all that rot.Furthermore, I’m of the school of thought that if you’re the smiling face of an unprovoked violation of a nation’s sovereign borders, you should fully expect the equivalent of “fuck your mother” from said nation’s citizens.And really, fuck this guy’s mother.

  • emsique

    OK, Bob. You’re a better man than I am. My good boy Catholic upbringing is appalled at the lack of respect shown the president. But my cynical self, who has watched as worse and worse men move into the presidency, thinks this is just peachy. Often leaders who displease their citizens enough get a lot worse. (Mussolini and Louis XIV come to mind).Bush lost huge face internationally, especially in the Arab world from this act of defiance. It seems a fitting farewell from the people he has most harmed.

  • Bob_Cesca

    >>I just can’t see how a person as educated as yourself can still see the Presidency as a mystical title.I don’t see it as a mystical title. There’s a difference between a respect for the presidency (I also have an enthusiasm to learn more about it) and blind religiosity.>>I feel that no man is above any other.You don’t have Secret Service protection, so neither should the president, then. Am I following you on this?

  • thespacecowboy

    I, too, agreed with your earlier post and though I don’t think a clarification was necessary, I’m sure there are others that may appreciate it.Civics – it’s not just for breakfast anymore (and probably has not been taught in our high schools for quite some time).

  • http://unrelatedcontent.com Travis Disaster

    I think this is just a case of my being too liberal in your eyes. Personally, looking back, I’m bummed that Reagan pulled through. Bad things should happen to bad people, regardless of job title. I’m not advocating assassination, but on the other hand if an Iraqi (rightly) uses a physical display to show great disrespect for the man who happens to be President, I’m not losing sleep over it.

  • GItheJOE

    Bob, excellent clarification but unnecessary. I and some others got your point the first time, HUMANITY and RESPECT.I am no saint! I am not judging anyone for their angry and rage against Bush but claiming that Bob has forgiven Bush of his sins and claiming the Presidency is a farce is wrong. If I believed the highest elected office in the land was bullshit I wouldn’t of voted absentee from Iraq in 2004 or this time for a great leader.Travis, What do you want? What are your suggestions about the shoe or knife or bullet? Should Bush have been killed? Should we all praise violence and hatred? What is your personal experience with violence?I can tell you the hardest thing in the world is to be shot at and not shot everything in sight. We are Americans and don’t praise violence against our leaders.

  • Bob_Cesca

    >>I think this is just a case of my being too liberal in your eyes. Personally, looking back, I’m bummed that Reagan pulled through. Bad things should happen to bad people, regardless of job title.

  • http://girldujour.wordpress.com girl du jour

    Not only is the shoe throwing what they do there (as I pointed out on the previous post’s thread) but I’m pretty sure that the shoe throwing was in response to Bush offering his hand to shake the hand of the Prime Minister’s — which he was apparently not supposed to do. Bush should have known THAT by now.Again, different country, different ways of doing things.

  • ceu

    I thought the video was hilarious right up until I realized that it could have been grenades being thrown rather than shoes. (On a purely visceral level, I wish one had hit him.)HOWEVER, on a more …civilized?… level, physical violence is not right. Insult Bush? yes. Scream at him? yes. flip him the bird? definitely. But ya don’t resort to throwing things. We don’t throw shit, we don’t come to blows in the Congress, we don’t give crime victims weapons to be used against a perp, and we don’t chuck stuff at visiting heads of state. I’m sure the thrower was horribly frustrated; that doesn’t make his actions acceptable.The closest example I can think of is the shooting of Lee Oswald. It might have been deserved, but it still wasn’t right.

  • http://unrelatedcontent.com Travis Disaster

    I’m not advocating doing said things, which WOULD be a sociopathic outlook. But really, how am I supposed to feel bad for people who wouldn’t piss on me if I was on fire? The Bush crowd and the conservative movement on the whole has sent this country on a path of monumental failure- if anything bad comes their way through act of man or god, I can’t imagine why I’d think twice about it.But again, to clarify for this audience (and lest I get a knock on my door)- I never think that murder is justified or the right thing to do. It’s why I think the war in Afghanistan was the wrong choice. It’s also why I think that the people behind it deserve nothing but scorn, disgust, and most of all disrespect.

  • http://unrelatedcontent.com Travis Disaster

    And again, really, the shoes weren’t meant to hit Bush, it was meant as a sign of disrespect. Sort of like Italians spitting on the ground to curse someone.

  • http://obamaproject.windonwater.net QueenTiye

    girl du jour: thanks for reiterating the cultural insult the PRESIDENT was making, again, on behalf of the American people.There are a ocuple of different issues – we need to separate them to avoid talking past each other:1. The Office of the Presidency2. Bush, specifically3. Civil disobedience (including, apparently in Iraq, shoe throwing)4. OUR response to a physical assault on the president.This seems to be a good moment to point out what Obama keeps saying “We only have one president at a time.” At a time when all the world would be more than grateful for Obama to push Bush aside, and say, as he’s made to in that picture Bob posts “Chill the “F” Out. I Got This!”, Obama is still respecting the office of the presidency and the incredible solemnity of our peaceful transition of power.QT

  • http://girldujour.wordpress.com girl du jour

    Here is a story on this from the New York Times today.http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/16/world/middleeast/16shoe.html?_r=1Also, I first read about this in Le Monde. I really like reading the international papers and getting a different perspective other than the US MSM.http://girldujour.wordpress.com/2008/12/14/cest-le-baiser-de-ladieu-espece-de-chien/

  • ceu

    >>But really, how am I supposed to feel bad for people who wouldn’t piss on me if I was on fire?That depends on you, although i don’t think anyone’s asking you to feel bad for Bush. Me – I hate (despise, abhor – pick an adjective) him. Under this administration I have lost so much BUT the person I am – the one I have to live with – would throw a bucket of water on the same people who wouldn’t piss on me if I was on fire, if they were. (That was a convoluted sentence but I hope the point was clear)I do enjoy a certain amount of schadenfreude, though. :)

  • http://obamaproject.windonwater.net QueenTiye

    {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{ ceu }}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}Awesome post. :) QT

  • PackyJ

    Jesus, Bob,You not only opened the can of worms, it’s been flung all over the room. Worms are hanging off the drapes and ceiling.First, I agree with the premise that we Americans should respect the office of the U.S. President, no matter what kind of mealy-mouth lying bastard holds it. We have methods, legal methods, of removing them if they are too contemptible, and thanks to the rule of law, they can only wreck things for 8 years anyway.Second, any assault on the President (even a relatively benign shoe-throwing incident), even Bush, is disturbing. It COULD have been a real attack, and the preparations to prevent such an event and the subsequent response by the Secret Service is less than comforting.That being said, I’ll repeat that I do NOT condone Muthathar al Zaidi’s actions, but they are, if you place yourself in … his shoes … (sorry) kind of understandable.Other citizens of the world do not place the office of the President of the US, nor the holder of that office, on any kind of pedestal. In most democracies, they don’t even put their own leaders, or the office, on any kind of pedestal.They do offer respect, but after an initial honeymoon period, it’s something one has to earn.Bush had the opportunity to earn that respect, and he just couldn’t be arsed to do it, even in eight years.Most world citizens don’t see an office o fthe POTUS. They see a man. A man they hold directly responsible for the debacle in Iraq, the probable endless conflict in Afghanistan, the further destabilization of the Middle East, and an increase in terrorist activities around the globe.If the “shoe attack” were intended to actually physically harm Bush, Muthathar al Zaidi would certainly have chosen a far more lethal weapon.Shoe-throwing and calling Bush a “dog” was a terrible insult, a demonstration to the Arab world of al Zaidi’s utter contempt for the man.That’s something Bush HAS earned in spades.

  • midad

    I will admit it was incredibly cathartic to watch. I myself have hurled an object at my office TV when Bush was talking about two years ago about some fool thing or another, and have the little black spider looking damage to my screen.But you’re right ultimately we cannot condone such a thing. With Barack about to assume the presidency, flying objects at TVs or shoes thrown at scoundrels (who NEVER deserved to be president) will no longer be necessary. I do take some happiness that this incident will be one he will be remembered for. Kind of fitting.

  • gypsysoul

    i really feel like i am in an alternate universe…bob, qt, gi…i understand your point of view which i practice daily, but i feel this instance is more than someone saying something you don’t like or cutting you off in traffic.this wasn’t by an american who was standing up for the wrong doing of this president (qt-this president DID have final say in this war – whether he was fed bad info from others or not- it’s his name on the orders!)this was an iraq citizen who i can only imagine is furious beyond belief by what bush has done to his country and people!as i posted on previous thread…imagine if the person responsible for killing 100,000 of your country’s civilians was standing in front of you essentially boasting about the “win” for the people of iraq….what would you feel? what would you want to do?rape has become rampant, deaths of innocent women and children, etc… i am NOT a violent person but if i was to come in contact with the persons responsible for acts such as this saying they were justified i am not sure if i could control myself either.

  • Ellen

    I guess I see it more as a protest action instead of a violent one. As I’m sure you have heard by now, throwing a shoe is a sign of extreme disrespect, the sole of the shoe considered “unclean” as it touches the ground. Thus it seems more a political statement than anything. I agree with some that what is disturbing is that he was able to throw a 2nd show with no interference, and that the Secret Service didn’t make a move until after the 2nd shoe. I don’t want any physical harm to come to W. But I have a hard time feeling that he was in danger of such from a flying shoe.

  • http://obamaproject.windonwater.net QueenTiye

    I agree with everyone stating this was a protest action, and not a violent one. But if you don’t know that – it looks violent, and it’s reasonable for an American to be alarmed. I agree too that the protest is justifiable, but as an American, I’m alarmed at THAT too. It is distressing how much contempt our sitting president has earned us. To Travis’s point, yes, America has been guilty of plenty throughout its history – some of it contemptible. But there has always been a tension with America – the ideal versus the actual. I feel that President Bush trampled all over the ideal – the thing that America stands for even when we don’t live up to it as we should. I’m not at all celebratory about the disgrace that America is in in the eyes of the world. Not for us, and not for our incoming president.Gypsy – I’m not sure I know what you mean by this:

    (qt-this president DID have final say in this war – whether he was fed bad info from others or not- it’s his name on the orders!)

    I don’t think I implied otherwise?Anyway – what I’m saying is that I think there’s a lot more agreement here than disagreement – but that I side with Bob on the subject of respect of the office, and concern about secret service response.QT

  • LameDuckHunting

    Bob, your points are well taken and certainly reflect a higher road than Bush would ever deserve, or even take, for that matter. Bush has inspired such profound anger and hatred in so many people, here and around the world, that it is difficult not see it as some form of just dessert for THE MAN HIMSELF.

  • Nanotyrnns

    I’m with you Bob on this not being an incident for us to be happy about. I was disturbed to hear my local progressive talk radio hosts this morning talking about how the guy should receive a medal for what he did. I don’t think he should have gotten the beating he did, either.I’m certain there are people, citizens of our own country, that believe our incoming president should get far worse than a shoe thrown at him and we would not tolerate such talk if it came spewing forth from right wing radio/tv/blogotubes.As much as I despise George Bush, I don’t want him hurt. I would, however, love to see him indicted, tried and then imprisoned for his crimes. Oh, how the sound of him shitting his pants at the verdict would be so sweet…

  • gypsysoul

    let me claify…as i am defending the shoe chucking man i in NO way would be doing so if it had been an attempt on bush’s life! i could see the want for such an act but never would i take it to that level or support others taking it to that level…also…the shoe should have never been given the chance to graze bush’s head! secret service seems as clueless as bush or obama supporters…”so obama when is the press release of incoming s.s.?”

  • jane

    Holy Carp, kiddies, I just watched the video. NOONE TOLD ME Dana Perino got a black eye from a microphone!Now THAT’s justice!

  • gypsysoul

    qt previous thread…”The PRESIDENCY is not Bush. The Presidency is the Presidency – the office that represents us – all of us.”

  • PackyJ

    Though I’m pretty straight-laced, I am no heel. I do have a sole.There’s apparently MORE to this shoe story than meets the eye…http://www.236.com/blog/w/lee_camp/shoes_thrown_at_bush_revealed_10732.php

  • steve

    Bob, I agree completely. This guy was able to throw not one but TWO objects at our supposedly well-guarded President with impunity. They were shoes but they could have easily been knives or grenades. And our next President has already been the subject of numerous death threats, not from wacky, shoe-wielding Iraqis, but from people right here in the U.S.A.I’m not about to suggest, as some have, that only Presidents we agree with deserve safety and protection.

  • http://www.ieatgravel.com/ Alaska

    I think you guys have all analyzed your feelings and opinions much more than I have the desire to do for myself, but I was surprised by my gut reaction.I find our President a terrible person who has cost many millions of innocent lives and I’m sure he’s much more evil than I give him credit for… but when I saw the video, my first feeling was protective anger. Kind of like, “He may be a motherfucker, but he’s MY motherfucker… and nobody puts motherfucker in a corner.”If I thought about it more, I’m sure I’d disagree with my first instincts but, for what it’s worth, there they are.

  • http://obamaproject.windonwater.net QueenTiye

    Ah… for some comic relief, feel free to click over here, and see how this discussion resolved itself: http://www.exisle.net/mb/index.php?showtopic=56118QT

  • LameDuckHunting

    I would like to have the opportunity to rephrase myself:Bob, your points are well taken and certainly reflect a higher road than Bush could ever deserve, or even take, for that matter. But, Bush has inspired such profound anger,hatred and frustration in so many people, here and around the world, that it is difficult for many of them not see it as some form of just dessert for THE MAN HIMSELF.Upon reflection, my writing too quickly on the fly made me look like I was a) attributing a different opinion to you than your own, b) possibly condoning violence, and c) coming off more generally doofy than I usually do.Thanks, I feel better.

  • http://willpen.wordpress.com willpen

    I came back here to comment on the original post from this morning only to find that the proverbial shit has hit the fan here.After re-reading all the comments what I come away with is a feeling that people are reacting more to the concrete aspect of this act rather than to what it represented.Sure it is wrong to physically attack the POTUS, who “ideally” represents America. We have never taken an attack to anything American, lightly. We have retaliated as needed, some times with forethought, and sometimes with little thought at all. Many of our governments past or present have felt that we have the right to strike back at our enemies as needed. We are certainly not shy about swatting somebody else like a fly while we fire a warning shot over their heads.The symbolism here, however is extreme and very important. We have been given a warning that we need to take our heads out from up own asses to try and understand that how we base what is culturally accepted is nothing like what the rest of the world does.George Bush had the audacity to sneak a trip to Iraq in order to continue on his “legacy project”. Then he had the temerity to stand up in front of room full of international journalists to continue the delusions that he has been harboring in his head. He did not give one thought past assuaging his own horrible guilt and failure. I can just imagine how this man must have felt seeing this “American” standing up there and spouting lies. His visceral reaction was most likely one of tremendous repulsion.However, as I mentioned before, we must use this as a learning tool. We need to assess how the Arab world perceives us and how we as Americans can better understand what we need to do to show the Arab world that we do have respect for their cultures and ways. This small act of throwing a shoe has become so powerful an act that it is being spoken about by people like us all over the world today. There is a symbolism here that so expands on what we all got up on November 4 to do. I personally think that America symbolically should start throwing shoes everywhere to show how much we have been disrespected by our own government. Do I want to literally throw shoes at the President? Hell NO! Do I want to continue to drive the point home and to keep driving it and driving it until maybe this “narcissistic and egotistical” little piece of a man finally accepts the fact that he is reviled by both the people of his country and the world.If you are interested in another take on this subject, I have just finished reading a great post on : http://www.lefteyeonthemedia.wordpress.com

  • JimmyJames

    I get what you are all saying. But it was a shoe. Not a grenade, not a weapon. It was a shoe. And violence against the POTUS is bad no matter who is in the office. But this wasn’t an attack, it was a show of disgust. And I doubt that any president in the History of Presidents could deserve something like this more.GB will never be tried for his crimes, will never EVER once have to answer to ANY of his countless victims and will probably live out his life in the finest luxury possible for a human being, surrounded by people who will pat him on the head and tell him what a heckuva job he did. He will never read or hear a single word of complaint lodged against him. If it’s possible, he will live in a world where he will be EVEN MORE INSULATED from the truth of what he has wrought than he is now.So when this jackass flies to Iraq one last time in a sorry attempt to pad his legacy by ginning up another bullshit photo-op, I can’t say that it upsets me that this incident disrupted everything. I am glad that this is what will be remembered. It’s the very least that he deserves.I have a great amount of respect for your opinion Mr. Cesca, and you are right that throwing shoes at the President is wrong. It probably sets a bad precedent. Still, this President, in this situation……it feels so right and I think an exception can be made as long as it is decidedly nonviolent.

  • Kat

    I can certainly respect your point of view on this one, Bob. I am normally not a proponent of physical violence either, and I certainly do not advocate physical violence against the president. If anything, that sort of activity will just get your ass thrown in jail. Perhaps with this situation, it was voyeuristic pleasure in watching someone do what I have fantasized about doing many times before. Each time I watch that smirk on my television screen, holding himself up as some sort of Godly man doing what is best for our country, I feel an intense need to fling something at his lying face. So perhaps that is why I cannot muster any strong feelings of horror that someone threw a shoe at our president. Perhaps al-Zaidi did something I’ve been longing to do for 8 years.At the same time, I suppose our president being a major motherfucker doesn’t make this sort of behavior right. And as someone pointed out in either this thread or the other, if someone did this to Obama, we would be throwing a damn fit.

  • http://willpen.wordpress.com willpen

    I just wanted to add, that I have been coming across a sort of grassroots effort to start some sort of symbolic “shoe throwing” protest. I have just posted something myself on the Mudflats Forums asking for ideas: http://www.themudflats.net/forum/index.php/topic,5010.0.htmlI will be following up on my blog with any updates. If anyone has any ideas please let me know. I am thinking about some sort of virtual shoe throw online petition to be signed and sent to the White House.www.willpen.wordpress.com

  • SamusAran

    Bob is good. Even when I disagree with him he somehow manages to impress the hell out of me.Bob makes me want to be a better woman.(If anyone is inspired to throw a pair of shoes at me for that cheesy remark, could you please make sure they’re size seven and a half?)

  • Nicky

    The backlash going on in the streets of Iraq right now should be the main take-away from this story. Not only are people in the streets rioting for the journalist’s release, but they are burning American flags. Personally, I find that frightening. I don’t think we could have needed Obama more at any other time than now, at this time in history. I hope he can bring back respect for this country.

  • frictionsoul

    Has Limbaugh said it was just some Iraqi blowing off steam?I think it’s hilarious and quite appropos (the time, the place, the expression). I wonder if his act just helped Iraqis feel better about themselves and their future, just knowing that someone succeeded in putting Bush in his place.This had nothing to do with the office of the POTUS and everything to do with the man who suspended 800 years of law (habeus corpus), so please Bob, get off the high road because in this case it’s just every bit imaginary as a victory in a fake war.

  • Casey Vaughn

    “I, too, agreed with your earlier post and though I don’t think a clarification was necessary, I’m sure there are others that may appreciate it.Civics – it’s not just for breakfast anymore (and probably has not been taught in our high schools for quite some time).Posted by: thespacecowboy at December 15, 2008 02:32 PM”Bob, Space cowboy…I’m with you.

  • watchdog

    As a member of the military I am required to show a certain level of respect for this guy no matter what, but as civilians all of you are not required to show him any respect whatsoever. As an elected office the Presidency is a representative of our country (not the people, the peoples reps are the members of the house), the fact is who WE elect (or allow in Jr’s case)to the office of president is a more telling reflection on us than anything else. We allowed this guy to be our country’s representative in two elections, and while Jr fooled half of the American public at least twice, he was never able to fool the rest of the world.To get respect you have to earn it, George Bush has never done anything in his pathetic and worthless life to earn the respect of anyone. As far as I’m concerned the only bad thing from this incident was the Secret Service’s poor response, I feel no sympathy for Bush, I do believe the man was trying to hit him with his shoes and I would not normally condone such an act. but as I stated above, Jr. has done nothing worthy of repect, he is barely worthy of the token respect that comes from being President, and had he conducted himself with even a hint of honor or even humility there would not be so many around the world cheering the shoe-thrower today. Bush has tainted the office of the President as well as America as a whole, I am glad there was no serious injury but a part of me still wishes that at least one shoe had hit. Such feelings stem from knowing this asshole is most likely going to get away with it, that George Bush is a bigger criminal than Al Capone and we probably wont even get the satisfaction of him going to prison on tax evasion (or for that matter contracting syphilis and going crazy).I would reserve my sympathy and respect for the office of the President for someone who is truly worthy of it (something you civilians can do), Jr. had a chance to be respected and decided that he would rather be feared. Now he’s finding out that fear eventually fades, what respect he could have had is long gone and once he leaves office he probably wont get even the barest minimum of respect outside the US. I wonder if he even realizes that he’s not likely to be welcome in any country anywhere after Jan 20th.

  • http://www.osborneink.com Matt Osborne

    Attempting to put some context into this discussion: everyone who attended the press conference had gone through a security gauntlet with metal detectors, etc., so there was NO WAY IN HELL the shoe-thrower would have had a grenade to throw.SECOND, the choice of a thrown shoe is a deliberate, but only semi-violent, insult. It’s the same element of Arab culture that had Baghdadis beating the face of Saddam’s statue with their shoes. It’s the middle east’s version of the middle finger, combined with the slapstick effect of a pie in the face. This is literally the worst humiliation one could inflict on someone.Third, it is long past due for someone to make George Bush Jr. (can we all start calling him “Junior” again??) look like the cowardly idiot he is. The image is in place. It goes right next to the video of Bush in the Florida classroom listening to “My Pet Goat” with the sign behind his head: READING MAKES A COUNTRY GREAT. The “legacy project” died when the lame duck ducked.

  • EL Mystico

    Wow there’s a lot of stuff here but… here we go.I’m with shoe guy. And here’s why. First of all, it was meant to humiliate not harm. A shoe hurled from across the room isn’t going to do any damage to a healthy adult of the species, unless it’s traveling at relativistic velocities and I’m pretty sure the Iraqis don’t have that technology. We all know by now that the shoe thing is a traditional insult in the Arab world.I saw some old footage of someone throwing salad dressing on Pat Buchanan on MSNBC this afternoon. You know what Pat Buchanan did? Said he needed to go wash his hair, and excused himself from the Q&A. In these sorts of situations the only thing that’s going to get hurt is feelings. The people who do the throwing get it out of their system and the victim-esque person gets to show that they can take a slapstickery. Or whine about it, in which case, point to the dressing tossers. Seriously, the only thing Pat Buchanan has ever done that doesn’t make me want to throw salad dressing on him was his reaction to getting salad dressing thrown on him.With regards to this sort of sentiment: “They were shoes but they could have easily been knives or grenades.”- In that room? Really? The secret service lets a pair of loafers get tossed and all of a sudden it “could easily have been” a grenade? No one gets into a room with Bush and al Maliki anywhere much less in Iraq without being screened, probably by multiple levels of security. I doubt anyone could have even smuggled a pie into the room. I say pie because I think it would’ve been funnier. (It’s a classic for a reason, right?)Meanwhile, the debate about our respect for the office, well first off, it wasn’t an American who did it. If I threw a lemon curd tart at Gordon Brown, how many people here would be that upset? And what if it was at an illegitimately elected foreign leader who had as much blood on his his hands as our guy?I’m not saying we should go around tossing shoes at Presidents all willy-nilly, but if a guy decides to bomb my hometown for no good reason and someone tells me I can’t so much as sling a sneaker in his direction- I would tell them to go hell.

  • longlivethefighters

    I’m with Bob and here’s why: I despise Bush and I reserve the right to criticize the President ’til the day is long (which I do). His pathetic approval rating it in the US is justly deserved.BUT…I used to pick on my little brother, I admit it, and I actually thought he deserved it for being such a weenie. But whoa to the the outsider who picked on my little brother because that person had me to contend with. I admit the hypocrisy. There’s no logic to it. And yet…that’s the way it is.I think of the CNN talking head who commented that the show thrower would not be breathing right now had he chucked his loafers at Saddam.

  • Cabot

    I agree with Bob. I may not like President Bush and I may think he’s an incompetent waste of space who has ruined our once great country but the fact remains he is the President of the United States. There is a fine line between dissent and outright sedition and any assault on the President should be met with condemnation. I am from Wyoming and it kills me that Dick Cheney is and always will be associated with my state. Vice President Cheney is a bastard whom I despise but when I was invited to the West Wing to meet with him do you think I called him vile and reprehensible; no, I treated him with the respect of the office once held by the likes of Adams, Jefferson, and Truman. Cheney and Bush are idiots who deserve nothing but our disdain but the offices they hold deserve respect, it’s what our fathers taught us.

  • http://wallenfeldt.com/blog Wally

    First off: I am in total agreement. This is infantile at best, and idiotic at worst.The whole shoe-as-an-insult-thing is a Middle Eastern phenomenon. We don’t do that as an insult here. So, culturally, it is not even a joke.And yes, Bush is still – like it or not – the president. *WE* can bag on him like that, but no other country would enjoy seeing their leader slammed like that. Plus, the shoes actually DID hit an American flag. If that doesn’t offend you, maybe it should.Yes, things will be better when this guy is out of office. Yes, the Iraqis have more than enough reason to loathe Bush. But can we at least let the clock run out on this guy without further fanning of the flames?

  • EL Mystico

    I’m not sure it’s still ‘outright sedition’ if you’re not a citizen of the country you’re seditioning against.