‘Right America: Feeling Wronged’

Well, that depends on how West Wing: The Obama Administration is doing in the fourth season. I bet if they don’t get picked up for another four goes, then he’ll pull off the mask and reveal his secret identity. But that’s in the future. Right now, I’m just looking forward to the Lost crossover episode where Air Force One crashes on the island and Timothy Geithner gets eaten by the smoke monster.

That’s the magic of it, Bob. The mask never comes off because he’s not wearing a mask, but the unmasking is always just around the corner. Read all about it in this new book! Call now and we’ll include this End Times survival kit!The “End Times” never arrive, of course. But we are perpetually on the cusp of “End Times” because it is good business. A substantial minority of Americans actually believe Obama’s middle name is “Nicholae Carpathia” or “Damien Thorn.” The influence of televangelist eschatology and the Left Behind series is its own end. Tim LaHaye laughs all the way to the bank.I saw this coming 20 years ago when I first watched Jack Van Impe’s “ministry” sandwiched between early-AM infomercials. Such religious nuttery has much in common with the bizarre ravings of Coast to Coast. Just substitute reptilian overlords for Jesus, and you’ve got Art Bell. Then there are the more secular paranoia-peddlers like Alex Jones, for whom any news story — no matter how trivial — “proves” the existence of a global, yet human, conspiracy.These people have fascinated me for a long time; I can only take so much of their poison before tuning them out. But I have made a study of them for 20 years, even going so far as to visit real libraries and do unpaid, un-graded research on my own time. Maybe that’s because their world-view is so incredibly opposite to mine, but I really can’t say for sure WHY I have studied them as much as I have.The roots of their ravings go all the way back to the beginnings of the John Birch Society, HUAC, and the Red Scare; one can even say they are anticipated by the 19th Century “Know-Nothings” and anti-Masonic movements. But whereas a conspiracy theorist will turn this into proof of ancient conspiracy, it is merely proof that humans are paranoid creatures.The sum of all fantasist paranoia is that our government is colluding with sinister agencies to annihilate US sovereignty and put us all under one world dictatorship. That same story has existed in different versions for longer then most people realize; the Book of Revelations is a seminal conspiracy text.But when you put these belief-systems under a microscope, they all share the same essential narcissism. The government is after US, “they” want to destroy OUR freedom, it’s all about US — basically, the world revolves around ME.Wikipedia’s definition of Narcissistic Personality Disorder calls it “a pervasive pattern of grandiosity, need for admiration, and a lack of empathy.” There is no more grandiose theme than End Times; there is no better example of a personality cult than a conspiracy theorist; and if one thing unites wingnuts everywhere, it is a lack of empathy. Why else would so many conspiracy pimps endorse the neo-isolationist candidacy of Ron Paul? America first and all that.Sorry to post such a long comment, Bob, but you struck a nerve, and it’s rare that I find a forum where I can even talk about this openly.

But when you put these belief-systems under a microscope, they all share the same essential narcissism. The government is after US, “they” want to destroy OUR freedom, it’s all about US — basically, the world revolves around ME.

Nail’s head, meet the hammer. Brought to you by Matt Osbourne.Really excellent post, bro. My sincere thanks.

Outstanding post, Matt O. Thank you for sharing.

Perfectly worded, Matt! I have often thought the same thing, but had trouble putting into words. Your comment about the narcissistic mentality is spot-on!

Matt, your post is so well-stated.Thank you.I watched this documentary on HBO – or at least I tried.I didn’t quite make it through some of the middle parts.These people actually scare me. Mob mentality. So limited. Religious fanatics. Narcissistic personalities, as Matt so aptly stated.I’m a 63 year-old retired teacher. Who knows how much longer I’ve got on this planet. I so haven’t got time to let these “meat puppets” scare me.But they do. And I swear 95% of them actually believe the bile they spew forth.~Shudders~

I’m here in a reach-across-the-isle frame of mind. I’m not doing the reaching, mind you. I’m here on your side, but I’m asking you to reach with me now. Not physically reach but reach your mind.

I saw Alexandra Pelosi’s documentary last night and instead of saying, “What idiots!” like my son, or “What narcissists!” like Matt Osborne, I asked, “How am I like these people?” And, further, “what do I appreciate about these people?”

Here’s my answer. Like them, I’ve felt marginalized. I’ve felt, say during even the first Gulf War, that the media’s take on what was going on was distorted. I didn’t hear any voices against the invasion of Iraq, then. (Well, actually, I did, but not in what the right calls the MSM.) That’s probably not the best example but the example isn’t the point. The point is I know how it feels to see those around you proceeding with certainty in a direction which you feel is, if not wrong, at least un-nuanced.

And I appreciate these people’s clarity. They know right from wrong. They have values. Yes, we can see that these values are internally inconsistent and self-serving, but I can appreciate how it feels to know what’s right and to not have doubts. I envy that feeling. And if, like them, I was lucky enough to find that mental space, how easily would I give it up? How hard would I fight those who might try and disturb my clarity?

If these people were a nationality or an ethnic group, I would want to preach some kind of tolerance/understanding for them. Aren’t we classist to dismiss them as idiots or narcissists? Aren’t we all idiots and narcissists at times? Are we so sure our position is absolutely superior to there’s, and if so, isn’t there a kind of narcissism in that? And aren’t we self-serving to want to force the richest 1% to pay higher taxes?

What I’m saying, I guess, is, if we’re unwilling to question ourselves and ask “What are these people right about?” how can we expect them to question themselves about what they’re so sure about?So that’s my mental reach. I think Ms. Pelosi was trying something similar and wasn’t just asking us to gawk at the freaks.

JimI understand and appreciate what you are trying to say, thank you.I do have a couple of feelings that I would like to share about it, if you don’t mind.First, yes I sort of envy their “faith”. I do not have the kind of faith they have. I am not sure if that is bad or good, I don’t think it matters. What I think does matter is that they want ALL of us to conform to their beliefs. If you read Matt’s piece, and I will defer to him because my experience being related to some of these people is similar. They believe they are right and they have the bible and god on their side.My own religious/spiritual views are not as clear as theirs is for them. However, what I think my problem with them is this.I want a seperation of church and state. I like that the founding fathers insisted this was a foundation. This above anything else, other than their apparent disregard for the “values” they espouse unless it works for them, is my problem.We are Americans, diverse and of all religious backgrounds, or none at all. That is the beauty of our system. But when one group repeatedly says I am unpatriotic because I do not agree/follow/support a particular person, then I do not feel the need to walk a mile in their shoes. I have walked miles for 8 years while they told me I wasn’t an American. I do not feel the need to listen to them anymore. I want them to shut up and let us try our way for a while. You know when the middle class is strong, this country and the majority of the people are stronger.about them feeling marginalized….they put themselves in this position by being so inflexible as to appreciate where the other 49% of us were in 2004. I hope I am not coming off as bitter, because I m not. I am only tired. They get everything they want, although some don’t think w went far enough. Then when 53% of the country dispute their way, they cry? Really? I feel no sorrow for them at all. None. It is a rude awakening to be where they are. This I know because I was there in 2003 when we first crossed the border from Kuwait to Iraq.I have asked your question “What are they right about?” I got nothing. I think they were wrong to confuse the seperation of church/state. I think they were wrong to dismiss the other 49% of this country when we didn’t agree and they marginalized us. I think they were wrong to get us into the mess we are in in the middle east. I think they were wrong to think that security means more than our constitutional rights. I think they were wrong to not see the gray areas about a lot of the problems we have been facing for 40 years. I think they marginalize me becuase I don’t want the govt in my body.I, again, thank you Jim for your idea. But for me? I have to live with people who think this country was just fine under their “guide” and I want them to stop tinking through their lense of religious values and want them to look at this country through the lense of being an American. You can be all the religious you want to be, I don’t care. But I do care when you try to make me conform to your views. It is just,sometimes Jim, so hard for me to care about what they think. They were wrong and they still don’t get it. I want them to realize we live in a Democratic Republic, not a theocracy. I want them to know that even though I don’t agree with them, I wish them no ill. I don’t care if they believe what I believe or not. I have not thrown my views down their throats, nor do I intend to. I want my voice to be heard, finally. I thought it was in November and surprse! they are still talking.I think you will find that the people who come here have respect for them until they disrespect us. That makes it sound like nanabooboo, but it isn’t. Until they have respect for my beliefs and my thoughts, they should not expect respect from me.Sorry all for such a long post, but like Matt, I do not have a forum to speak like this.And Jim, I do understand what you are saying, I do. I just think it should be posted on one of their sites. I, again, think if we were not told automatically because we voted for a Dem that we are going to hell and are unAmerican, the world would be much better.Just my 2 cents, thank you for allowing me to post Bob.

Wow! Some really excellent points from everyone. Thank You Matt, Jim & VeraLynn for food for thought. I especially loved your post, VeraLynn, when you spoke about respect bringing forth respect. Some individuals come onto threads with guns a blazin’ and names acallin’ then wonder why they get slammed by GI or Elvis. I especially hate when people come onto the PTT with some snarky comment for their first post, then act all hurt when they are ignored. Introduce yourself! Be polite & share something non-political (esp. On the PTT). Give us a chance to know you first.

This was a good thread. Bob, can we talk about this again some time?

I can’t believe what is being said on this documentary! Embarrasing. Hopefully, these people will take their own advise and move out of this DEMOCRATIC country.