Loud Noises

how the hell can a statement like that offend a bob cesca follower?! i don’t get it…

I had actually been restraining myself from pointing out the offense there.Speaking in tongues is no kind of crazy, btw. As a sincere practice, it has been studied and documented, including outside of the evangelical Christian experience. Interesting stuff, related to meditational states, and like anything else, exploited sometimes by religious opportunists.QT

queen, no offense but “speaking in tongues” is “wear a helmet” crazy! now what i just said there…that’s offensive!

As much as I love speaking in tongues, fear of music is still my overall favorite…….

queen just to add…i have personally seen people who appeared to be speaking in tongues. it was a native american cultural thing and i can tell you first hand it was drug induced!

Speaking in tongues is all sorts of crazy. I certainly wouldn’t have apologized for offending the type of nutbag that engages in the practice. Just my opinion though.

I love speaking in tongues. Especially with hot young military boys.

Drug induced, means slightly hallucinagenic. People can induce mind-altered states through meditation, and without drugs.You don’t really ever catch me making fun of religious practices, so long as they are self-contained and not harmful to the person or people around them.QT

The fringe faction covetously claim dibs on patriotismand religion, so any reference, no matter how metaphoric,is fightin’ words to that mind set.Threatening to no longer follow your stories, now that is harsh.Ouchie ! Good thing, now this poster can spend more timefinding and using a dictionary.

Halla bo la jumba ta de sedy walunga pasana fala tu rekta.

Whop bob a loo bop a lom bam boom……

Speaking in tongues is no kind of crazy, btw.

Sorry, wrong. And since I don’t mind offending anyone, I’ll come out and say it: If you regularly speak in tongues, you’re Batshit Crazy. There’s something seriously wrong with you.I’ve been to snake-handling churches and charismatic churches, and I’ve been in the room when two gentlemen with a Disgruntlement between them decided to settle the matter by stabbing each other with pointed objects, and the charismatic/snake-handling churches terrified me far more than the Stabbery.I’m sorry, but this is the 21st Century™; if you honestly think that some Unnamed Spiritual Whatsit gets up in your shit and inspires you to make with the Blatherment on behalf of The Jesus or any other Abrahamic Super Person, you’re crazy and should be expedited to the Cracker Hatch.Or at the very least, your opinions should have no matterment in my life or the lives of any sane adults that aren’t moved to blubbering like a 3 year-old because Peeing Your Pants with The Joy is considered Bad Church Etiquette.

There is no such thing as speaking in tongues…unless its pertaining to sycophants speaking Mediadorkese on Twitter.

>>Halla bo la jumba ta de sedy walunga pasana fala tu rekta.HA!!>>I love speaking in tongues. Especially with hot young military boys.Is that speaking in tongues or using your tongue? Please clarify.I don’t think, “Oh God!” is speaking in tongues. But have I been known to bust out(ha) a little farsi.

Oh, and I suspect that (former) reader was just another Republicon plant trying to make you feel guilty seeing through con man bullshit twofold.

queen, i see the point you’re making. i’m actually a spiritual person (there, it’s out) but there is a difference between the crazy of a drug induced, speaking in tongue, body shaking person and someone gaining a higher level of self awareness through meditation.that being said…don’t try to tell me that shit when i’m high, ripping on my broom jimi hendrix style.

Curly, I just spit beer all over my keyboard — but you’re wrong: Remain In Light is their best — come on, man!

And, Bob, I think it’s safe to say this dude wasn’t a true fan anyway: he did call your shit “stories”.

Bob, please retract that apology. whoever said that was full of shit.

I was waiting for somebody’s feathers to get ruffled about “speaking in tongues.” Don’t stop using it, Bob.I’m with Elvis. It’s goddamn lunacy. I grew up in the Evangelical church and have seen “speaking in tongues,” “slain in the spirit” and “David dancing.” It’s narcissistic BULLSHIT. “I’m so special there’s a spirit inside of me! Look at me!” This leads to self-propelled fuckheads believing they have the only true answers because Jesus is in them. Deep in them. (See: Iraq War, Michelle Bachmann, Sarah Palin, John Ashcroft, Torture, and so on and so forth.)

But…aren’t they kind of the same thing? I mean, the whole point (in my limited knowledge) of speaking in tongues, etc. is that you’ve reached a higher plane of understanding than those who don’t. And that’s the TOTUS argument: you just don’t get it yet, and if you did, you’d agree with us.

>>>”I’m so special there’s a spirit inside of me! Look at me!”hahahaha…oh, that’s funny!

Brother,You are forgetting the translations of “speaking in toughs”. See one idiot rolls on the floor speaking in absolute bullshit. Then, a really important(more filled with The Jesus) person translates the absolute bullshit into something like, “Don’t be fooled by the secret muslim!” or “The US government has officially turned it back on the my house(The Church Industrial Complex)”. See there is a rank structure to the Batshit Crazy.

Actually what is known as speaking in tongues in some modern Christian sects does not correspond to the Biblical description, which says that this is literally speaking a langauge you have not learned, not just blathering in nonsense syllables.So anyone who understands and actually values the word of the Bible should be MUCH more offended by the modern practices called speaking in tongues than the reference you made, Bob. I also think your apology should be retracted.(sometimes having a lapsed Baptist for a wife is very useful – she’s the who that pointed this out to me)

Redmond said:”Jesus is in them. Deep in them. (See: Michelle Bachmann, Sarah Palin”Quite the visual you have going there, my man.

Liberal Creeps such as Bob Cesca have been lampooning George Bush for the last 8 years for slips in grammar and word errors made in open mike and impromptu addresses. Obama can’t even say “Good Evening Fellow Americans” without the use of a teleprompter. Now it’s out turn.

I agree with Elvis. Anyone speaking in tongues is batshit crazy and probably a fan of Glenn Beck. No need for you to apologize.

Speaking in tongues is, of course, nonsense and we do ourselves and our reason a disservice by pretending it is not.It will make you end up like John Shell there.

Come on, people, I have blasphemy in my title for crying out loud! Pharyngula is in the blogroll!You were expecting undue reverence?

Agree with all above who say it’s nonsense. Would like to add that it scares the shit out of me that the two leading candidates for GOP nominee in 2012 are the type of people who buy into this bullshit.So here’s hoping the economy picks up in the next few years, or we may be welcoming Sarah “protect me from witches” Palin, or Bobby “the exorcist” Jindal into the White House.

I aim to please, James. And so does Jesus. Little known fact.

Or at the very least, your opinions should have no matterment in my life or the lives of any sane adults that aren’t moved to blubbering like a 3 year-old because Peeing Your Pants with The Joy is considered Bad Church Etiquette.

Kinda what I said…

You don’t really ever catch me making fun of religious practices, so long as they are self-contained and not harmful to the person or people around them.

QT

Nice multi-boxing there, Queenie!

Grrr! Trying again… but without the blockquotes!@Elvis: Yeah, what I said was – “so long as it is either self-contained and not harmful to the person or someone else.”All my point is is that lots of religious practices can seem crazy to those who don’t share the beliefs. For the majority here who are unreligious – I imagine that that includes just about all religious practices. And for Bob’s sake, with the blaspheming blog header, notwithstanding- it’s not picking on anyone’s particular beliefs, whereas speaking in tongues IS, and yes, there are some Bob supporters who probably do… lots of African American Christians are probably also Bob supporters, given his early support of Obama.I’m not willing to agree to give every brand of religious practice a free pass. But if it harms no one, I don’t see much purpose in taking aim at it.QT

Oh. I thought it was french kissing, communicating with tongues intertwined. That I cna understand.But when it’s just babbling… well QT, can these so-called utterances actually be translated? If not, what’s the big deal?

Oh boy…. I’ll have to take the glossolalia thread to my own website. I’ll link here during the PTT when I’ve posted. It’s an interesting topic.QT

With all due respect, is there any religious practice that doesn’t harm anyone, considering they all enslave us to the lie or, at least, the non-truth?

John Shell said:>>Now it’s out turn.Seriously, people, who is out and why does he get a fucking turn?

James, there is one. Have you heard the good and noodly Word of the Flying Spaghetti Monster?

count me in as one of those “intolerant” types who thinks speaking in tongues is full-on batshit crazy.

Ok, Redmond.I KNOW what “speaking in tongues” is.WTF is “slain in the spirit” and “David dancing?”It sounds homoerotic.

I have now. What are Its views on beastiality?

I’m with Richard Dawkins, by the way. Indoctrinating your children in wacky beliefs can make them unbelievably credulous–side effects include suicide bombings and casting votes for Sarah Palin or Michele Bachmann. The attacks of September 11 were a faith-based initiative.

Redmond, I bet I’ve seen more pew jumps than you ever will.

Also, for Packy, “slain in the spirit”.

I’ve stayed out of this, but I do want to make one point: not all religions are harmful. The vast majority are, for a variety of reasons (they engender division and hatred, engender a lack of reason and science which is necessary in this world, and give people a way out of taking responsibility for their own actions). But not all religions are. Buddhism, for example (though that’s honestly the only one I can think of).

Mr. Cesca,You are really impressed with yourself aren’t you. Typical of elitist liberals.

James, there’s nothing in the Eight “I’d Really Rather You Didn’ts” about bestiality, so I guess it’s okay provided it’s consensual.

Jay – Yep. Cesca is really impressed with himself. All of us are impressed with ourselves, elitist liberals that we are.Impressed with you? Not so much.

Kyle:I like the idea of Benny Hill as my religious guide better than the idea of Benny Hinn.Ramen.

fe: I hear what you’re saying, brother/sister, but I was a Buddhist for a couple of years and I can tell you that, in my experience, it was harmful. Of course, it isn’t killing people or adovating phobias in the same way Christianity is, but it did cause me — partly — to have a nervous breakdown.Basically, my mother died at a very young age and I, seeking to gain some perspective on the whole thing, turned to Buddhism and its philosphy of “What does it matter?: we’re all going to die anyway.”, along with the practice of meditation… I truly believe that both contributed to a state of denial within me, which ultimately caused me to snap and utterly, totally lose my shit.Now, I’m sure it works for some people — and a lot of its philosophies are ones I do subscribe to (vegetarianism and so on) — but I wouldn’t advocate it ahead of rational thoughtfulness any day of the week: one doesn’t need not bow down to ANYTHING in order to live a happy, fulfilling live.

OMG-The only way to never offend somebody, somewhere, is to never speak. I’m sure even that offends somebody.I’m offended at people who write in and are offended by statements about whatever it is that they are offended at. I demand an apology for all the times that I was offended, and didn’t get an apology. And if that apology isn’t as good as or better than the apology for the “speaking in tongues” crowd, then I’m offended at that too.

Hey, Jay? Why don’t you explain your position with some of The Facts and The Figures instead of stooping to ad hominem attacks. We tolerate civilized dissent around here but dropping by to shit from the mouth for no particular reason is frowned upon, sweetheart.

I’m still waiting to hear what David Dancing is…. Are there veils involved??

I can’t type for shit! Forgive me, I’m Irish and, thus, drunk.

ceu: I’m not sure, because I’ve been away from evangelical Christianity for a long time. BUT – I’d bet David Dancing is referencing the book of Samuel where it talks about David dancing like a crazy person in praise of God. Being slain in the spirit is when you see people fall out and faint – sometimes entire rows of people.And, as scary as that is (and I do think it’s a little bit scary), calling it crazy misses the point. People fall out at rock concerts too.QT

James: it’s sister, by the way.I think you and I disagree on the main premise of Buddhism. I’ve been practicing for a long time now, and I’ve never seen any sort of “What does it matter; we’ll all die anyway.”

It’s dancing that won’t get you sent to hell, Chris.

If you speak in tongues then you are batshit crazy. Bob shouldn’t apologize to these nutters.

@CurlyI’m torn between Remain in Light and Fear of Music.But then again I’ve been burnin’ down the house because I’m on a road to nowhere.

Just adding two comments:1. Buddhism is not a religion as the term is commonly employed.It is a philosophy. There is no god, only the eight-fold path as described by the Buddha. It is neither a theistic or deistic “religion.” That said, it still possesses many of the cultish qualities exhibited by the rest of the sheep herding God freaks.2. @ JamesI’m not prepared to accept that your attempt at the practice of Buddhism was the cause, or even a contributing factor, to your breakdown. Sounds like you had plenty of weight on the scales already. It may not have been the panacea you were looking for; it may have been unable to prevent the inevitable, but blaming your flirtation with meditation for cracking up is, in logic and fairness, rather a stretch (although, if it had been any of the WWJD schools of mental health maintenance, I’d be far more willing to accept the premise – those fuckers are mostly evil)./hola bawonga dwit fala samano//reporting from Samsara and speaking in tongues, this is Cousin Avi for ANN.

durka durka durkaTranslation:They took our jobs!

okay,im not sure where exactly the insult was to the people speaking in tongues.ive never actually done so myself,but i know people who have,and as someone with a very serious,very intense sort of faith,i dont find it especially crazy if its sincere.however,i cant imagine anyone who has spoken in tongues being offended by others not being able to easily comprehend their meaning.and that,i believe was the point of your comment.

Queen, we share a lot of attitudes and even the same religion, but I am not going to give ANY scientific credence to speakers-in-tongues. It’s babble. Psychologically, all they do is trigger their infantile noise-maker. If it really was “speaking in tongues” as spoken of in the Book of Matthew (no relation!), there would be intelligible words in SOME language.Just because lots of people believe in Santa doesn’t make him real, either.

The whirling dervishes practice a form of David Dancing. The frenetic dance leads to a trance-like self hypnotic state in which one feels more in touch with the creator. The dervish dance involves rotating hence ‘whirling’.I seldom intend to hurt anyone’s feelings with my comments, however some people should not read things on the intertubes since an adult level of cognizance is assumed here. This boils down to ‘Fuck ‘em if they can’t take a joke.’

@ 24hourjackSincere? As I understand it, those who speak in tongues make the claim that the spirit of god is making them utter “words” in a language unknown to anyone present (although understood by god), said unknown language spoken in praise of said god.Just wondering how sincerity comes into it?It’s nothing more than oath-helping. A rather silly display of foolishness designed to give the appearance to the assembled faithful (read “deluded”) that the utterer has experienced some sort of direct connexion with the almighty.”The Holy Spirit commanded me” has been an excuse for more than enough vicious and ugly crap that I’m not willing to grant it as an explanation for anything…good, bad or neutral.Sure, chanting may well induce altered states of consiousness…so do shrooms, LSD and ketamine (in which states users often speak of transcendental, mystical, and quasi-religious experiences). None of it demonstrates the presence of the imaginary sky wizard.The difference between tongue yammerers and druggies is that druggies aren’t scampering about telling everyone else that they’re going to hell if they don’t start dropping purple microdot.

I love speaking in tongues. Especially with hot young military boys.

Keep your panties on, Kat.

@cousinavi: I don’t see why they shouldn’t! Having Leary’s Witnesses showing up at my door with some free stamps would be much more amusing than some of the people who do go door-to-door.

Oh, good lord, Kat! Ya know what it resembles? That scene from The Music Man when the old women’s club was doing the interpretive dance…”One Grecian Urn…”apologies to you whirling devrishes out there

Keep your panties on, Kat.Carl, you always want to ruin my fun.

cousinavi…i really wasnt intending to go to bat for tongue speakers.i was just saying that im really in no position to pass judgement on someone who feels closer to any god they choose to worship,whether they actually are closer or not.i mean,you’d have to be a real fucking twat to pass judgement on the religious beliefs of others just because it sounds “crazy” to you.yep,you’d have to be a grade-A jitbag.y’know what i mean avi??

@ 24hourjackooh. veiled name calling. color me chastised.In fact, I pass judgment on religious belief as a matter of principle solely based on the simple fact that it’s a statement of certainty regarding a claim for which there is no evidence.I don’t care whether it’s speaking in tongues, zombie potions, snake handling, burning incense, whirling dervishes or gobbling blessed crackers, it reveals a weakness of spirit leaning on a ridiculous crutch. So sayeth me.Yet more oddly, you seem incapable of recognizing that the very sort of muddle-headed gimps that pretend to speak in tongues are pretty much the exact same bible inspired thugs who bilk old women out of their savings in tv pitch scams (Robert Tilton et al), condemn homosexuals to hell, seek to deny women control over their own reproductive health, demand that creationism be taught in the science classroom, and a host of other “do it my way because god instructs” bullshit.So, yeah…I do pass judgment on those who profess religious faith. They’re mostly, save for a very few quiet sorts, a leeching poison in the well of society.I absolutely agree that people are perfectly free to worship whatever god they so desire. They’re also free to believe in unicorns, that the earth is flat and that shoving live bees up their nose will cure cancer.And I’m perfectly free to adjudge them, in varying degree, as dumber than a bag of hammers.On that note, you may cram a grade-A jitbag(?) ALL the way up your ass. If you want to tolerate a bunch of theistic idiots dragging the social bell curve off in weird directions over their conviction that one or another magical spirit takes particular interest in what you do with your dirty bits, you go right ahead.Frankly, I’d like to see “Freedom of religion” amended to include the obligation to keep it to your damn self. Coincidentally, to the degree that they do so, I’m a whole fuckin’ lot more tolerant.”Respect for religion”. Pfft. Milksop crap from the spineless.

I spent 16 years in that “panty-costal” BS, and I wasn’t offended by your remark at all!Glossolalia, as practiced by the bouffant-haired polyester pant-suit crowd (and those are just the men) is based on a loosey-goosey reading of the King James Bible, and is supposed to be some sort of private communication between the fanatic and God, interpretable by some special grand exalted poobah with a Little Orphan Annie secret decoder ring.That fit your use of the term “speaking in tongues” perfectly, Bob-O!Carry on!

“A Neuroscientific Look at Speaking in Tongues” from The New York Times:http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/07/health/07brain.html?scp=1&sq=speaking%20in%20tongues&st=cse

CycloCynic:You’re wonderful for finding this article. I am still wiped out from my trip and having trouble pulling my own post together or picking a direction – this article will help immensely.QT

You are obviously a complete idiot and really DON’T know your facts. Obama more qualified than George Bush? Have you been living in a cave? If Obama gets his way, the government will be telling my kids when they can go to the bathroom and when they can’t by the time he leaves office. Let me and my children make our OWN decisions on health care and other major issues, and get government out of the way!!By the way, the simple title of your blog shows your complete disregard for everything this country was founded on. You truly do NOT know what you’re talking about.

cyclo and queen, that nytimes article reveals nothing. it even states “So it’s not so clear what that finding says” about speaking in tongues.speaking in tongues and deep meditation showed the same results in the study. and let us not forget the commercial…”this is your brain…this is your brain on drugs” hehe…sorry my frontal lobes are still “quiet” from my level of intoxication last night.

dave, “what this country was founded on”?! the mass genocide of native americans?!?! yeah, you republican whiteys are really to be admired! fuck off!

Being a universalist, I have often wondered at the act of speaking in tongues, and modern definitions of it. The bible clearly pointed out that speaking in tongues was the “spiritual” ability to speak a language you had never spoken before. I’ve heard of people, not Jesus related, who have accomplished this in modern times. Probably I’ll chalk it up to luck. Nevertheless, the division I see here is between those who believe, and those who don’t. What the two sides do isn’t the real issue, yet both sides use it to dehumanize the other.Since the real issue is belief or non-belief, why not focus on that? Let’s face it, you don’t need to believe in God to be “bat-shit” crazy. There’s more than enough evidence available to prove that. So one side calling the other “bat-shit” crazy = bat-shit crazy, in my opinion. The pot calling the kettle black.It’s easy to dehumanize people when you lump them all into a group, because group-think is often far more “insane” than individual thought.You can hate the church or the religion, but when Billy-Bible is standing next to you in the grocery store, and he allows you to skip ahead of him because he notices you only have two items to check out, how much do you hate him then? Or do you punch him in the face for making you feel stupid for hating him? And when Annie-abortion calls you just to see how you’re doing since your mom died, are you going to tell her she’s a sinner and should burn in hell?When we reduce the group down to individuals, it’s awfully hard to hate anyone. Yet we don’t complete that thread by regularly acknowledging that EVERY group is made up of individuals.People like Glen Beck, Billo-the-clown, and Keith Olberman speak to the lowest common denominator. They speak to the mob. But the mob is not representative of humanity, at all. To see humanity, you have to see one person.

Oota toota, Solo?Seen Religulous? (I know you have).Speaking in tongues is pretty whacko – and a bit of a misnomer since it’s been shown people aren’t actually speaking in a foreign language or ‘tongue’.

gypsy: Your frontal lobes are “quiet” because of your level of intoxication? Truly? And – was that at least partially the point of getting intoxicated in the first place?QT

Gyps,You’re right to point out the drug connection. Drugs alter our state of consiousness. So do prayer, mediation, and speaking in tongues.Also, most artists, writers, and scientists will tell you that they’re in an altered state of consciousness while doing their best work. This state is commonly known as “The Zone.”I’ve pasted in a couple of links on the neuropsychology of The Zone below. The first is a general reference (sorry for the lenth, but if you scroll through, you’ll find info on neuroscience), the second is about the neurophysiology of jazz improvisation.www.actionforex.com/index2.php?option=com_content&do_pdf=1&id=598http://scienceblogs.com/neurophilosophy/2008/02/the_neuroscience_of_jazz_impro.php

QT, you’ve got your info straight. We’ve been over this topic again and again on my blog.(Adding: My typing is awful this morning).

queen, as someone who stocks her shelves with various tequilas yep i would say quieting my frontal lobes was the sole purpose last night! cyclo and queen…i stated way up in this thread that i see the point you are trying to make. i believe through deep meditation and “focus” (for lack of a better term) one can achieve a clear, concise, higher level of thought, understanding, reasoning, etc. a “zone” like state where things seem to flow with ease. the brain, as much as we do know, is still a variable. why do some people have a brain injury and start speaking a foreign language? i don’t know (and i’m not looking it up..hehe) but i do know that the majority of speaking in tonguers imply that it wasn’t just an elevated level, it was god, a spirit, the devil that was speaking “through” them. (like they don’t have anything better to do?!) and i think that is b.s.! esp. when most of them are “faking” or drug induced! listen, i’ve ouija boarded a time or 20 in my life and guess what…i was the one secretly moving it! hehe…

Gyps,I’ve been around my share of people “speaking in tongues,” and I agree that it can be easily faked. I also doubt that any information is conveyed by the garbled syllables uttered by people in this state.However, as a meditator, I’m reluctant to dismiss it. I suspect that some people gain comfort and/or insight from speaking in tongues. Insight may come from any altered state of consciousness, even if it’s just insight into how one’s own mind works.

Gypsy:As I stated on my own web site, people wrap dogma around the experience – but the experience itself transcends dogma. The NYT’s article points out that the neuroscience points to an experience that would certainly FEEL like some entity beyond oneself flowing through a person to create the experience. As a person who formerly experienced speaking in tongues, I can attest to the following:1. It’s a learned response. People speak in tongues mostly when sufficiently surrounded by people speaking in tongues. (After the first time, a person can induce the experience all by themselves – but the first time is largely around others doing it.)2. It isn’t a necessity – it’s a response. Because it’s learned – it’s just one possible response to the mental state that is affected when you do it.3. It can be faked, and you can differentiate between when you’re faking it, and when it’s a real experience.4. The spiritual aspect of it is the mental state – I state this despite Christian dogma that argues that the Holy Spirit is praying FOR the Christian in a language they can’t understand. Or better said – the Holy Spirit praying FOR the Christian is allegorical language to describe the benefits of the altered mental state. Christians (most Christians who believe in speaking in tongues, I think) would aggressively disagree with my assessment there. The speaking in tongues part is rather extraneous to the experience, but in Christian circles, it serves as external confirmation of having reached the right state of mind.5. Agreeing with the anti-glossolalia crowd – because the experience is so personal, and so emotionally invested, it is easy for someone to manipulate people who practice this, and rely on others for scriptural interpretation. Again – I’ve seen this first hand, and it’s scary as heck, and yes, crazy-making. In my opinion, it’s kind of the equivalent vulnerability that a crack addict might have to a drug supplier – who can very easily manipulate the addict into doing things for the supplier in exchange for the next fix.QT

cyclo and queen, you are proving my point in a more informed, researched way. do you guys not see that? (that’s not meant to be bitchy. hope it doesn’t come off like it is!)

Gyps, you’ve made several points. Which ones are you referring to? If it’s that altered states of consciousness can be:A. faked, andB. dangerous, then I agree.(Nothing like arguing on the same side, huh?)

Wow.A visit from Dave teh Fascist.”You have the freedom to think exactly like me or else we will waterboard you until you do.”Dave, Newsflash. We can think whatever we want whether or not it meets with your approval. That is what is meant by a free country.Bush was a criminally negligent incompetent.

Gypsy’s opening point:

queen, no offense but “speaking in tongues” is “wear a helmet” crazy! now what i just said there…that’s offensive!

second point:

queen, i see the point you’re making. i’m actually a spiritual person (there, it’s out) but there is a difference between the crazy of a drug induced, speaking in tongue, body shaking person and someone gaining a higher level of self awareness through meditation.

I’m responding to these two negative assessments. That there can be a craziness to the practice – your two statements blanketly condemn the practice wholeheartedly, and ascribe the practice to drugs.Inasmuch as Bob’s opening post was about a (former?) supporter of Bob’s writings, who took offense, I think it’s fair to consider one of the two possibilities: the poster was never really a Bob supporter, or was. In the latter case, I think it also reasonable to conclude that they might not have been crazy – the research CycloCynic has put forward negates the idea that the practice is typically drug-induced OR the product of mental instability. Other research on the subject similarly negates these stereotypes.Here’s my bottom line: Obama’s coalition is wide and deep. It incorporates a bunch of people who are now actively engaged in politics and otherwise might not have been. I don’t have a problem with trying to get along with the non-religious amongst the Obama coalition. But it seems that the non-religious might have a problem trying to get along with the religious in the coalition. I think that’s not a good thing, and whenever I can speak up to change that dynamic – I will.Bob inadvertently insulted lots of innocent bystanders who have nothing to do with the utter insanity of Glenn Beck. He apologized. He hasn’t turned into a religious apologist because of it – he’s just demonstrated genuine goodheartedness, and good sense. No good reason to antagonize others in your tent, just because they are different from you.QT

fisrt, don’t get me confused with some of the other people on here who disrespect the religious. i only make negative comments about religion when that religion is effecting people outside of that religion!second, i don’t care if someone is bent over licking an ant because they feel like it, something in their body is telling them to do it, whatever, that’s their life, i don’t care. i’m not searching for this stuff to make fun of it! but if i come across it i’m going to call them crazy! because in my mind it’s crazy and my thoughts or words are not harming or stopping them from continuing their crazy!listen, i’m a yoga/pilates girl! i do it everyday! there has been a 180 in my life since i have been doing it. i get that hippie dippie spiritual mind altering meditation thing BECAUSE I DO IT! so, i don’t really understand where we are missing each other in these comments. i mean, from your own words, queen and cyclo, you state that speaking in tongues is a learned behavior, can be faked, a response to the environment, an altered state of consciousness etc. i learned how to tie my shoes! i can do that shit without even thinking about it! do you see where i’m going with this?! there IS a difference between religious/cultural where the “spirit” enters the body and “calming” ones mind through meditation!without “drugs”, it’s all about “consciously” trying to explore your “subconscious”. like i said, i don’t study the brain, so i don’t know what goes on with it, but doesn’t heat exhuastion, high fever, sleep/oxygen deprivation, injury also alter ones thinking/consciousness?! so are drugs necessary? no. but they are not taboo when trying to get to this elevated level!about the “zone”…i’m a designer. i shut my eyes and designs magically appear in the darkness of my eyeballs. hehe… how? why? i don’t know. but that is when i get my best designs, when they just pop out of nowhere, with no inspiration to them. i don’t get. never said that i did. but it takes my conscious ME to process what i saw and make them happen! so if someone isn’t “faking” or “drugged” or whatever isn’t it possible that they are just doing what i’m doing in trying to translate a feeling, image, emotion into something tangible like words?!also, sorry girls but those articles stated/proved absolutely nothing to me.