Prime Time Thread

Ed Shultz was killer today.

Now on my blog:9/119/119/119/11I wanted to address the Glenn Beck “LET’S RETURN TO 9/12/01″ nonsense a long time ago. Now I finally have time.I’ve known since the early half of this decade that this place had slipped completely when I listened to supposedly conservative callers to talk shows say that The Constitution is obsolete during these “unprecedented times” (DRAMA!). Until that moment I believed that although I disagreed with them about abortion, stem cell research, etc. at the very least they understood that The Constitution is the spinal cord of the republic. These same cons are the 9/12 freaks who want us to live in constant fear as the supposedly (according to cons) evil, incompetent government (as if they can even claim this anymore) strips away more of their rights.America needs to return to a pre-9/11 mindset. Let me explain. 9/11 was an incident that was consistent with a post-Cold War paradigm- a paradigm in which battle lines are blurred or nonexistent and a single, monolithic superpower is at the center of all things. It was not the beginning of anything new- it began when the Berlin Wall fell. It was not the beginning of anything that was unprecedented. We have survived worse things, and the people who panicked most are the people the cowards who were willing to surrender liberties. They are the people who are willing to accept torture, which is totally antithetical to freedom.When I state that we need to return to a pre-9/11 mindset, I’m stating that people should calm the fuck down and realize that it was a massive failure of our intelligence community, a problem that continued during the Iraq colonization. Even the attack itself was not unprecedented. It was not a failing on individual Americans’ parts. It was a symptom of the disease that was infecting the CIA and FBI; it was also a sign of post-Cold War times.Self-blamers should probably think twice when they state that they want the police to be more vigilant or that security at airports isn’t tight enough or that they believe that torture is necessary DURING THIS UNHEARD-OF CRISIS!!! SHRED EVERYTHING! START OVER! AAAAAHHHHH!!Dramatic pansies.

MG – You miss one point. Massive fear was the whole idea. They needed this huge explosion of fear to sell the patriot act and invade Iraq. The fear was the ends, the means was 9/11.

Ashby, please. Spill the proof.

John – Im not going to waste my time on you. You’ve shown all day how unreachable you are. You still believe we invaded Iraq for WMDs and democracy. You have a long long way to go.

Thanks for your nonsense Ashby.I’ll take that as a copout.

You can take it as whatever the hell you want, since your opinion isn’t worth dick anyway.

hey guys – there are at least 3 other threads on this subject. Please don’t bring it onto the PTT.

My opinion isn’t worth what?

Ashby: the true American….Hater.

Woah, Ashby. I first read that as “Ed Schultz was killed today.”

Ashby: the true American….Hater.See, here’s the thing, John. We’ve argued with you all day about this. We’ve presented facts & figures, source documents, etc. while you’ve parroted talking points with little thought involved We’ve been pretty fucking nice actually. But now you’re insulting one of our own and that’s not acceptable.so fuck off.

Hello my LibTard Bitches!!!!Wazzup??? I gave you dolts a few weeks off to see if your fantasies of Obamanation would come true, but just like any 300 pound white toothless skank hoping for the black dream to come true, neither has yours DOUCHEBAGS!!!!The economy still sucks. The Taliban laughs at us as they promenade across Pakistan and resurge in Iraq.Bwa ha ha fucking HA!!! Curious George has restarted the miltary tribunals!!!!Pelosi, the Botox Transvestite, is a WAR CRIMINAL!!!Need I mention that Rahm Emanuel still takes it up the ass,like all good libtard boys?

Skiba – Sorry, I meant he kicked ass today. Ed always kicks ass though. He is the ultimate rightwing talking point shredder.I have to agree with Jonathan Turley who was on Countdown just now. It sure seems like there is a whole lot more evidence in this case than there is a lot of cases that end up getting a guilty verdict.Ceu – I agree its already been discussed at length, thats why im not going to waste any more time debating it with a stooge such as John.Maybe its time to bring back a new system similar to, but not, typekey. The trolls are getting thick.

MG – You miss one point. Massive fear was the whole idea. They needed this huge explosion of fear to sell the patriot act and invade Iraq. The fear was the ends, the means was 9/11.Posted by: J M Ashby at May 15, 2009 7:18 PMMy post addressed PEOPLE’s reaction at the time, particularly cons’ (not pols) reactions (note the calls to talk shows– not politicians’ calls).The “big, bad gubmint” was to blame, so why do cons want to surrender more of their freedoms and allow the gubmint to torture and surveil everyone at will?”RETURN TO 9/12! I NEED DRAMA IN MY LIFE BECAUSE I LIVE IN BUM FUCK, INDIANA… WHICH MIGHT BE ATTACKED AT ANY MOMENT IN MY DREAM WORLD!”Pathetic.Hypocrisy to the max. Cowardice to the max. Drama to the max.

Well MG, thats just the side effect of living in a consumer driven sheltered society where education takes a backseat to entertainment and popularity.

And MG I am not sure it was a”massive failure of our intelligence community“I think it was more an ignoring on the part of BushCo of that intelligence Community. Clinton gave him the information, they had all kinds of info and they choose to ignore it.. so how do you say it was a failure of the intelligence community?Can you explain that to me please?

YEA yea yea wazzup wit dat? This fucking blog is deader than Hope and Change. Swagga, yes, that makes a great leader.

And propaganda.It’s very easy to propagandize people that only get their news from one source.Unlike John, some of us are smart enough to not trust new from any one country let alone any one source. The Europeans knew there were no WMDs. The French told us so quite vocally. We called them cheese eating surrender monkeys and renamed French Fries (well, all of the really stupid and easily led sheeple did), some of us knew that the french were correct because we were reading German, Swedish, and U.K. newpapers in addition to U.S. newspapers. There is no excuse for being misinformed when the internet connects you to the entire world. Fox News is the absolute worse place to use for real information. They are propaganda central. Their stories are typically bogus on several levels.

Doof Quote of the DayObama Says U.S. Long-Term Debt Load ‘Unsustainable’ (Update2)Share | Email | Print | A A ABy Roger Runningen and Hans NicholsMay 14 (Bloomberg) — President Barack Obama, calling current deficit spending “unsustainable,” warned of skyrocketing interest rates for consumers if the U.S. continues to finance government by borrowing from other countries.“We can’t keep on just borrowing from China,” Obama said at a town-hall meeting in Rio Rancho, New Mexico, outside Albuquerque. “We have to pay interest on that debt, and that means we are mortgaging our children’s future with more and more debt.”Holders of U.S. debt will eventually “get tired” of buying it, causing interest rates on everything from auto loans to home mortgages to increase, Obama said. “It will have a dampening effect on our economy.”and who’s plan was this?”“It will have a dampening effect on our economy.”Isn’t that exactly what Rush said it was? And what it would do?

Ler me get this straight, you have prood 9/11 was an inside job, and you already went over it with me so my opinions worth ‘dick’ and fuck off?You are psychotic ceu, Ashby.By the way Silly, you trying to impress Oliver Stone, in a crazy kind of loose and reckless way?

You are psychotic ceuYeah, okay, whatevHead’s up – Elizabeth Warren on Real Time.

Can you explain that to me please?Posted by: Annette at May 15, 2009 9:35 PMOne sentence: “Hey, this Arab dude told me that he only wants to learn how to take off, not land.”CIA response: “Meh.”

Actually the FBI had reported that MG, not the CIA. And it was ignored.

Just because you are ignorant of many facts John does not mean that we all are.My statements about election integrity issues in the U.S. can be easily fact checked. Pointers to the pertinent documentation can be found easily.Google: “California Secretary of State Top to Bottom Review”Google: “Ohio Secretary of State EVEREST”The documents from those two test will frighten anyone. I do computer security for a living. Our voting machines can not be trusted. At all.The Freedom to Tinker blog routinely covers election integrity.The Brad Blog is dedicated to election integrity.6 Documentaries exist which document what really happened in FL in 2000 and OH in 2004.By all means remain ignorant an ridicule me. Then you have the nerve to call people out on Hate. Another Gumby hypocrite.

Thanks Ashby.. that was my point.. the CIA and the FBI I believe both did their jobs, it was the Administration this time.. BushCo who ignored what they were told and thumbed their noses at everyone that allowed us to be attacked.

Can you say backfire? As in your pock marked scum stained face? Obamawitz is failing , as all liberals do, ala James Carter.Miltary tribunals are being reinstated? Say What?Health care reform will consist of rationing and restricted fees for service? Good luck finding a doctor with a GPA above 3.0.What joke.

Ler me get this straight, you have prood 9/11 was an inside job, and you already went over it with me so my opinions worth ‘dick’ and fuck off?sorry – can’t let it stand in its distorted form. You want to get it straight? Try FACTS. After a day of arguing civilly with you, you called Ashby an American-hater. THAT’s why i told you to fuck off – I made it very clear at the time I said it why i was saying it. And now you turn that into being a response to something I never mentioned – 9/11. I also never said that your opinions were worth dick (though that was probably remiss of me since your only interest is in repeating bullshit rather than having an actual discussion that involves actual thinking)And I’m psychotic.

WASHINGTON – President Barack Obama said Friday he would reform and restart the military tribunals he once reviled for Guantanamo Bay detainees, jeopardizing his timetable for closing the prison by January and dismaying many supporters who suggested he was going back on campaign promises.Now, after the detainees are given stronger legal protections — a ban on evidence obtained under cruel duress, for example — the trials of 13 defendants in nine cases will be restarted no sooner than September. Five of the 13 are charged with helping orchestrate the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.

NEW YORK – A Gallup Poll released Friday found that 51 percent of Americans now call themselves pro-life rather than pro-choice on the issue of abortion, the first time a majority gave that answer in the 15 years that Gallup has asked the question.The findings, obtained in an annual survey on values and beliefs conducted May 7-10, marked a significant shift from a year ago. A year ago, 50 percent said they were pro-choice and 44 percent pro-life — in the new poll, 42 percent said they were pro-choice.The new survey showed that Americans remained deeply divided on the legality of abortion — with 23 percent saying it should be illegal in all circumstances, 22 percent saying it should be legal under any circumstances, and 53 percent saying it should be legal only under certain circumstances.

Posted by: J M Ashby at May 15, 2009 10:18 PMI included “FBI” in the piece. If it was the FBI’s incompetence, so be it. The key phrase is “intelligence failure.”Posted by: Annette at May 15, 2009 10:25 PMI don’t want the president to micromanage everything that is presented to him from the intelligence community. The incident to which I referred occured during the late ’90s. I don’t blame Clinton. The chimp’s “alright, y’all done covered your asses” response was obviously totally moronic, but I don’t blame him. I don’t even blame Rice, although she was/is also an utter moron. The intelligence community itself should have monitored the situation more closely. “Al queda determined to strike” means absolutely nothing to me because the morons were too lazy to gather specifics.

NEW YORK – General Motors on Friday told about 1,100 of its dealers — one in five — that they would be dropped by late next year, adding to the economic pain radiating from the beleaguered Detroit automakers to cities and towns across the country.Including Chrysler’s decision a day earlier to eliminate a quarter of its own, about 1,900 dealerships — many pillars of their communities and heavy advertisers for local media — learned in a matter of 48 hours that they would be forced either to sell fewer brands or close altogether.The GM dealerships will be eliminated when their contracts end late next year.”We’re 98 years old. We’re two years from a hundred, and I don’t want to go out at 99 years,” said Alan Bigelow, whose family runs a Cleveland-area Chevrolet dealer that learned it was on GM’s hit list.While GM doesn’t own the dealers, the company says its network is too big, causing dealers to compete with each other and giving shoppers too much leverage to talk down prices and hurt future sales

Silly-Three engineering students were gathered together discussing the possible designers of the human body. One said, “It was a mechanical engineer. Just look at all the joints.”Another said, “No, it was an electrical engineer. The nervous system has many thousands of electrical connections.”The last said, “Actually it was a civil engineer. Who else would run a toxic waste pipeline through a recreational area?”

I am really not sure where to start MG.. but saying you are not blaming Bush for his response and his lack of attention to the warnings about impending attacks from al Qaeda is beyond my comprehension right now.He was the President at the time. He was the Commander in Chief… In the words of Harry Truman.. The Buck Stops Here.. That means it lands on Bush’s lap.. and bud.. it landed square on Bush.. He had all the needed intelligence, information, data and everything else.. and you want to give him a pass.Sorry, but that just doesn’t cut it for me.Yeah, maybe some of the others, Tenet, Rice and the heads of the intelligence agencies share that role, but it lays on him for the most part.

I am really not sure where to start MG.. but saying you are not blaming Bush for his response and his lack of attention to the warnings about impending attacks from al Qaeda is beyond my comprehension right now.’Posted by: Annette at May 15, 2009 10:50 PMHe didn’t specifics. Hey, a lone nut or group of nuts is probably going to attack this country sometime. Alright. I don’t have specifics, so I can’t really do anything, and frankly this report has been circulated since the early ’90s. What can a single man do with such information?He was the President at the time. He was the Commander in Chief… In the words of Harry Truman.. The Buck Stops Here..Posted by: Annette at May 15, 2009 10:50 PMHeads should have rolled at the CIA. Heads should have rolled at the FBI. We as a nation should have placed more blame on the monkey. What did the monkey do? He gave medals to them because he was the worst president ever. We re-elected him (stop with the Ohio bullshit).BUT THIS IS MISSING THE POINT.WE ARE STILL TALKING ABOUT THE GOVERNMENT.We, the people, took the rap for it while medals were given to these incompetent people. We took it up the ass. Some of us– the 9/12 cons– are begging to take it up the ass more. WHY? We want to make the government’s job easier, right? We want to surrender our freedoms to a group of idiots because they erred and we don’t want them to err again.Fuck that shit.

R&TThat’s a good one that I haven’t heard in many, many years. Thanks for the laugh.

Glad you liked it.

No WE didn’t.. I never voted for that SOB.. maybe you did.. so don’t count me in that.. I am not part of that WE.. I have done everything I can against him.Marched, protested, written, voted, called, everything I could do to keep him from winning. Even donated money I didn’t really have. So, no this is one person you can’t add to that WE…

MG -You are aware that three people were sent to prison for rigging recounts in Ohio in 2004 or are you not?Interesting that misinformed douchebags are willing to shout bullshit because they believe the propaganda they had anally inserted by the MSM.

I think I am going to call it a night.. have a good one all.. See you tomorrow.

Well, according to Obama “there is no blue state or red state” and we are all in this together and bullshit bullshit bullshit.Haha.

Hey Losers….the trolls out number you on your own blog. Oh yeah….you won the vote…67 to 62 million. Now if you excluded the illegal ACORN votes, illegals, the felons, Obama would have lost.Obama is NOT my president!!!!!

After the SCOTUS ruled that votes don’t need to be counted when you have an election and declared Bush the winner, a real recount was done over the entire state of florida by a historical society. They discovered by actually counting all of the ballots that had the entire state been recounted Gore had won by a fairly large margin. If you consider the vote suppression that Jeb had law enforcement engage in to prevent blacks and hispanics from voting it is likely that the margin would have been much larger.The election was stolen. That is fact. This truth is well documented. There is no question.

Who let the monkeys out of their cage?

ACORN is accused of voter Registration Fraud by the republicans at every election. Every election about a dozen ACORN registration employees are arrested and serve some time. That is over the entire country.Compare that with with a voter registration contractor paid by the RNC to register voters in the Tampa Bay area who had 50 employees arrested. Complaints came from thousands of USF students who had their voter registration changed from democrat to republican because the company only got paid for republican registrations and the employees changed all of the democrats to republicans.The same contractor got into the same trouble in L.A. where they pulled a similar stunt with UCLA students.Anyone bitching and moaning about ACORN is a delusional Talking Point dispensor. There has never been any prosecution of ACORN for any kind of voter fraud. The ACORN employees arrested were arrested because ACORN caught them cheating and turned them in. If you don’t know this then you are just getting your information from propagandists.Check the facts. It’s not my job to educate you. You obviously are incompetent to look things up yourself otherwise you would not be repeating redundently debunked bullshit like you are.Fuck Off.Mentioning ACORN as an evil voter fraud organization immediately reveals to me the following:You get your information from approved Propagandists.You are a loyal, plastic, unthinking automaton of your authoratarian leaders.

Bruce the wombat buggerer makes an appearence.Interesting day Ashby. I spent the afternoon seeing my doctor (routine quarterly visit) because a guy showed up exhibiting flu symptoms five minutes before my appt. so it took significantly longer than normal.

Atleast you weren’t fighting trolls all day.

You guys did well. You, ceu and Annette in particular. Lexaburn and Carl added some welcome spice. It was interesting reading.John thinks I don’t like him. It has nothing to do with him as such. I don’t like having debunked bullshit sprayed on me by people that have obviously never done any research on their own.You and I agree because we’ve read about the same evidence at multiple sites. When you’ve seen the same set of facts analysed six ways to tuesday by hundreds of people all over the place you can’t help but reach similar conclusions.BTW I’m sold on scenario five. I knew of some of the foreign nation data, but he pointed to some pieces that I had missed that finished the puzzle.The two items that have always bugged me about 9-11 were the collapse of WTC7 and the ‘finding’ of one of the hijacker’s passports at ground zero. Neither of those is credible. At all. WTC7 was a controlled demolition. It just couldn’t be anything else.

I’ve been trying to say that theres really nothing secret about any of it. Its all right out there. All you have to do is put it together.I just dont think the mainstream is ready for the notion yet.Look at what a hard time people are having with accepting the torture details.If they knew everything else, it would be anarchy.

Agreed. That’s why I limit myself here and avoid 9-11 references as much as possible.My goal is to get a special prosecuter investigating the war crimes aspect. I tend to think the investigation should be limited to that.

Now if you excluded the illegal ACORN votes, illegals, the felons, Obama would have lost.

Prove it.

In Florida in November, over 4,000 people who were eligible to vote were not allowed to vote because their names were similar to the names of felons. The court case is still ongoing.Also 20,000 properly registered voters were purged improperly from the registration data base because their names on their drivers license did not exactly match their names in the voter registration data base. Example: William Smith was prevented from voting because his driver’s license said Bill Smith. The court case on this one is also ongoing. 18,000 of those prevented from voting were democrats.The Florida SoS is a republican and is a highly partisan fascist. The law did not require, nor did it allow the purge. In fact he violated Florida election laws by purging the 20,000 names less than 90 days before the election. The purge was in late Sept.These stories can be confirmed at dozens of sites such as The Brad Blog, Black Box Voting, Voter’s Unite, and many others. For some reason the media tends to ignore these stories. The St. Petersburg Times covered the Florida stories but no national level coverage.The Republicans have a rather extreme record of vote suppression. They have been fined and sanctioned for repeated acts of voter supression in many states.These are well documented facts.Your stuff is made up bullshit.